The Minnis (Elmsted 1851)
Stelling Minnis
01227 709265
https://whatpub.com/rose-crown
Above photo circa 1910, kindly sent by Rory Kehoe. |
Above postcard circa 1910 colourised by John Lane. |
Above photo, circa 1934, kindly sent by Rory Kehoe. |
Above photo, 1935, colourised by John Lane. |
Above postcard, circa 1950. |
Above postcard, circa 1950, colourised by John Lane. |
Above postcard, circa 1951, kindly sent by Rory Kehoe. |
Above photo, January 1987, taken by Gordon Luck and sent by Dougie Moon. |
Above photo, January 1987, taken by Gordon Luck and sent by Dougie Moon. |
Above photo, February 1994, taken by Gordon Luck and sent by Dougie Moon. |
Above photo, February 1994, taken by Gordon Luck and sent by Dougie Moon. |
Above picture taken from
www.YourShepway.co.uk 2008. |
Above photo, circa 2023. |
Above photo, circa 2023. |
Rose and Crown signs December 1986.
Above with thanks from Brian Curtis
www.innsignsociety.com |
Above sign 2023, kindly taken and sent by Rory Kehoe. |
Above photo, May 2018 by Rory Kehoe. |
Above photo,
2023, kindly sent by Rory Kehoe. |
The census of 1851 also addressed this premises as Minnis, Elmsted.
An advert from the online paper yourshepway.co.uk in August 2008 said the
pub offered mid-week jazz and food, and that customers included
former Goodie Bill Oddie and ex-Conservative leader Michael Howard.
The pub had an excellent range of real ales and lagers and an extensive
wine list.
Their Chef Jackie was a commis chef to Gary Rhodes.
The pub has a large play area for families to take advantage of.
The bar opened from 10am until 12.15 am on weekdays and it ran until
1.15am on Friday and Saturday.
The kitchen served its delicious fare everyday from noon until 2pm.
Evening dining commenced at 6pm until 9pm on Thursday and 7pm to 9pm other
days.
Sunday lunch was available and pensioners can get their week off to a
kick start with special lunches on Monday and Tuesday.
Kentish Gazette, Saturday 17th June 1769.
To be sold by auction, on Wednesday the 12th of July next, between the
hours of 2 and 4 in the afternoon, at the sign of the
"Rose and Crown" at Stelling Minnis.
All that Messuage or Tenement, Barn, Stable, Garden, Orchard, and 60
acres of Arable and Pasture land, in the occupation of
Edward Pierce, situate and lying in Stelling.
For further particulars, enquire of Rob Tournay, Attorney, at Hythe.
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Kentish Gazette 23 October 1784.
To be Sold by Auction, On Wednesday, the 3d day of November, 1784, At
the House of Edward Pierce, known by the Sign of the "Rose and Crown"
at Stelling Minnis, Kent.
Between the Hours of One and Four of the Clock in the Afternoon,
A freehold Farm, etc., at Stelling, in Kent, in the Occupation of Mr.
John Quested, as Tenant at Will.
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From the Whitstable Times and Herne Bay Herald, 29 September, 1894.
FATAL QUARREL BETWEEN BOYS AT STELLING MINNIS.
The East Kent Coroner (R. M. Mercer, Esq.) on Wednesday held an inquest
at the "Rose and Crown Inn," Stelling Minnis, on the body of Ernest
Daniels, aged nine years, the adopted child of Mr. Thomas Beer, a
grazier at Stelling Minnis. Mr William Valentine Marsh was chosen
foreman of the jury.
Thomas Beer, grazier, Stelling Minnis, deposed that the deceased was
born in his house and had lived with him ever since. His mother was
Louisa Daniels (now Mrs. Louisa Howell of Dover), a daughter of John
Daniels, of Bourne. Witness adopted the child, and was present at his
death, which took place at 10.30. on the previous Monday morning, the
17th inst. Witness had two boys, Horace Hobday and Charles Hobday (12
and 9 years of age respectively), at his house for a month's holiday. On
Friday evening, the 10th August, witness went home and found the three
boys there. The little boy complained to witness's wife that Horace
Hobday had hurt him. He said they quarrelled over a bird's nest on the
Common. The nest was in the grass, and Horace stamped in it. Deceased
then did the same, whereupon Horace hit him on the stomach and back.
Witness did not attach much importance to the matter then, but on the
following Sunday night deceased went to bed and never got up again.
Previously to Sunday night there did not seem to be much the matter. The
boy got up on Saturday and Sunday about as usual, but did not seem just
nicely. On Sunday night he was taken very sick, and witness sent for a
doctor, who came at once. Witness scolded Horace Hobday for having hit
the boy. Hobday did not excuse himself at all. Witness did not say much
because
he did not like to say much to other people's children. The boys went
about on friendly terms on Saturday and Sunday. Witness first thought
the boy would die about a fortnight ago last Saturday. He did not think
it necessary to call in the police.
The Coroner explained to Mr. Hobday, who was present with his son
Horace, that if deceased died from the results of a blow struck in
anger, the boy striking him was liable to be punished for manslaughter.
He (the Coroner) did not suggest that it was a case of manslaughter, but
wished to point out that they had evidence that deceased was struck, and
that subsequently to that blow he died. He (the father) was entitled to
put any question be wished to the witness.
Mr. Edwin E. Lewis. L.S.A., London, a duly registered medical
practitioner, deposed that he resided at Meadowcroft, Stelling Minnis.
He was called in to the case on Sunday, the 12th August, at about 8.30
p.m., when be found deceased suffering from peritonitis. Subsequently
inflammation of the bladder set in, and was followed by dropsy. On the
following Monday morning witness met Horace Hobday at Mr. Beer's gate
and asked him how the deceased was. He replied that be did not know and
had not inquired. Witness did not ask him how it occurred. Witness had
no doubt that deceased that had been struck on the abdomen, which set up
the inflammation, from the results of which be died. On a later occasion
when Horace Hobday came to his surgery for medicine witness scolded bim
roundly for losing his temper. The boy did not excuse himself in the
slightest degree. Witness made a post-mortem examination on the 18th
inst., twenty-four hours after death. There was a quantity of serium and
pus in the abdomen, showing the extent of the inflammation. Both the
colon and kidney underneath were injured, the latter being congested
with blood; and the intestinal track was congested throughout its
length. Deceased increased about six inches in length, during the time
he was in bed, showing that he was extremely delicate. Death was caused
by exhaustion, following peritonitis, the result of violence. The whole
covering of the abdomen was one mass of inflammation. Presuming that the
violence was inflicted by blows, the boy must have been pommelled all
over. Such inflammation could only have been produced by a series of
blows.
The Coroner: Are you perfectly clear that it could have been caused by
no other reason except a blow?
Witness: None whatever.
Replying to the Coroner, the witness said the injury could not have been
caused by a fall, because one injury would not have set up all the
inflammation he found. Witness did not communicate with the police, as
he did not consider it his duty to do so. After about twelve days'
attendance, witness recognised that the boy was in a dangerous
condition. Then he rallied, and witness did not apprehend fatal
consequences until the night before his death. The boy was not of
powerful physique, but apparently of average good health.
Replying to Mr. Hobday, witness said it was a fact that he warned Horace
Hobday that if he gave way to big evil passions in the way he had he
would probably be hanged sooner or later.
The Coroner explained to Mr. Hobday that the boy Horace could give
evidence if he (his father) thought fit. He need not, however, do so.
Eventually Mr. Hobday decided not to put the boy Horace into the witness
box.
Charles Edward Henry Hobday, residing at 35, Trollope Street, Wandsworth
Road, Battersea, said he was nine years of age, and now in the 4th
standard. He appeared a bright and intelligent little fellow, and the
Coroner decided to swear him. He deposed that he and his brother came
down for a holiday at Stelling Minnis. They went out with Ernest Daniels
on Friday, the 12tb August, the first day of his holidays. On that
evening they went up the Minnis. A bird flew out of a hole and Ernest
went to look. Horace put his foot on the hole, and Ernest put his on
that of Horace. Horace then struck him on the stomach with his elbow,
and Ernest fell down and cried. After a little while Ernest got up.
While Ernest was crying on the ground Horace did not say anything.
Ernest was hit once—on the stomach—and lay on the ground face downwards,
crying. Afterwards they went home to tea. They played together on
Saturday, and went to Mrs. Knott's. Previously to the occurrence they
were all good friends, but Horace had quarrelled with deceased once or
twice before when playing cricket. The quarrel at cricket arose because
one said he was out and the other said be was not.
This being the whole of the evidence, the Coroner proceeded to address
the jury. He explained that children under the age of seven were
irresponsible in the eye of the law for crime, but over that age they
became responsible for their acts. The law said that if one parson in
anger struck another—although he did not mean to do any harm as a result
of that act—and the other person died, the aggressor was responsible for
that and was guilty of the crime of manslaughter. The question for the
jury to consider was whether there was sufficient evidence to justify
them in putting any person on his trial for manslaughter.
If there was a reasonable suspicion they were bound to send him to take
his trial for manslaughter. He (the Coroner) thought it was perfectly
clear that Horace Hobday did strike the deceased in the stomach, and the
doctor had explained very reasonably and carefully why he thought there
was more than one blow—the inflammation being too extensive. As against
that they had the evidence of the little boy—and anything more naturally
given than that evidence he could not conceive. It was a most common
thing for boys to give each other a dig in the ribs with an elbow, and
there did not seem to be the slightest evidence of any other blow.
Having regard to the manner in which the elbow was used he did not think
they could say the injury was inflicted in anger; it seemed to have been
a mere matter of horse play between the boys. If the jury were of that
opinion it would not be a case of manslaughter.
The jury having deliberated in private for a few minutes returned a
verdict to the effect that deceased died from inflammation caused by a
blow given by Horace Hobday whilst they were playing together.
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Whitstable Times and Herne Bay Herald. Saturday 31 July 1909.
Licensing.
George Boughton, licensee of the "Rose and Crown," Stelling, applied for
a licence to sell in a tent at Hardres Court, from 10 a.m. to 9, on the
occasion of the annual Flower Show.
The magistrates question whether it was necessary for the licence to be
from 10, but eventually granted it.
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LICENSING BOARD – 18 AUGUST 1999.
5. Application for the annual
renewal of the indoor public
entertainments licence for The Rose
and Crown, Stelling Minnis, Nr.
Canterbury.
Mr P Forgan, the applicant, told the Board
that the objections to the renewal would
be the subject of legal action and that he
would be preparing an appeal against a
Noise Abatement Notice recently served
by the Council.
The Health Officer expressed his concern
that in the past, entertainments had taken
place in the marquee when no noise
attenuation had been possible and a noise
nuisance had occurred.
There was no
objection to entertainments being held in
the bar with doors closed. It was clear
that given good management, the means
of controlling noise within the building
were adequate.
RESOLVED:- To approve the annual
renewal of the indoor public
entertainments licence for The Rose and
Crown, Stelling Minnis, Nr Canterbury,
subject to the condition that public
entertainment should be restricted to the
bar and restaurant area with external
doors and windows closed at all times, the hours to be restricted to:-
Wednesday, Friday and Saturday
11.00hrs to 23.00hrs,
Sunday 12.00hrs to 15.00hrs.
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LICENSEE LIST
PIERCE Edward 1784+
STUPPLES Henry 1851-61+ (age 44 in 1861)
BARTLETT Harriett (widow) 1891+ (age 44 in 1891)
BOUGHTON George 1901-09+ (widower also builder age 58 in 1901)
FORGAN P 1999-2014+
https://pubwiki.co.uk/RoseCrown.shtml
From Melville's Directory 1858
Census
From the Kelly's Directory 1903
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